Hank On Santana To Mets

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Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Wed Jan 30, 2008 10:39 pm

Hank On Santana To Mets

Via the Star-Telegram:

http://www.star-telegram.com/474/story/443646.html


"I can't really comment because it's not done. All I can say is that the Twins did what they had to do," New York Yankees senior vice president Hank Steinbrenner said in Tampa, Fla. "I hope it works out well for them. The Mets made a good trade from their end. Hopefully it works out for both teams.

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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Wed Jan 30, 2008 10:45 pm

Hank's reaction Santana To the Mets

Via the Star-Telegram:
[quote]
http://www.star-telegram.com/474/story/443646.html


"I can't really comment because it's not done. All I can say is that the Twins did what they had to do," New York Yankees senior vice president Hank Steinbrenner said in Tampa, Fla. "I hope it works out well for them. The Mets made a good trade from their end. Hopefully it works out for both teams.






I hope Cashman doing right thing. Cashman is really putting his reputation on the line with these young pitchers. The Yankees lose out Matsuzaka to Boston and Cashman went after Igawa as consolation price last year. This year Mets traded for Johan and The Yankees lose again. Next Year, I'm hoping that Yankees don't lose out on CC and Tex to Boston and Mets again. Also, Brian please Go after Yu Darvish if He were to become available next year via posting Smile


-twins try to extend santana, he refuses
-yankees multiple offers eventually get to hughes and melky
-red sox offers get to two offers that either include jon lester or jacoby ellsbury
-bill smith wants more players, holds out in the usual attempt to have the yanks and sox play against each other to drive the price up…which didn’t work
-yanks and sox eventually pull out of race
-twins try to extend santana again, he refuses and tells twins to make deal quickly with what they can
-twins are stuck with only offer on the table which is the mets 4 prospects that don’t even come close to equaling yanks or sox original offers


HANK, HAL, & CASH: FANS WANT ANSWERS


This is an invitation from friend who's a disgruntled Yankee fan. He's a season ticket holder and want answers. He want to know why the Yanks did not make a last-minute offer for the best pitcher in baseball, a power lefty who would be phenomenal in Yankee Stadium and could very well give them the ace they need to put them over the top. Yankees spent this offseason making a great move that gave Yankee fans hope by hiring Girardi. Yankees gave ridiculous money to A-Rod. He is also the greatest show on the planet. Entertainment value, I understand that. You gave stupid money to Rivera and Posada. Great all-time Yankees, yes, but hardly worth clogging up the payroll for the next 3-4 years for. You then look at what is a disaster of a bullpen and fill it with an unknown in Albaladejo and a has-been who chokes under pressure in Hawkins while losing one of the only semi-reliable relievers you had last year in Vizcaino. Lastly, the greatest pitcher on the planet becomes available and the Mets get him while only giving up four nothings. Rumor has it, Bill Smith came back to you Cash for a last minute offer and you didn't bother making one. So, this is where I as a season ticket holder, ask you to respond and tell me "why". IF Smith still insisted on Hughes, fine I understand, that's ok. IF you suspect Santana has an injury, fine I understand, that's ok too. IF you refused to part with a package centered around Ian Kennedy OR used money as an excuse, I hope you are as far away from the new Yankee Stadium as possible next year. My friend also says this team is built to win NOW. I certainly have my doubts about winning now with a rotation that has a 36-year old steroid user, a sinkerball whose sinkers seemed to stop sinking, a 38-year old Moose who's career is over, and 3 rookies who have never thrown over 150 innings. Sure, A-Rod will put on a show hitting all of those home runs. Joba will entertain pumping his fist after striking out hitters on 100 mph fastballs. This is a show. But fans want more than just a show. They want to win. Namely a World Series Championship. How about giving the fans and older players like Mo, Posada, Moose, Andy and Jeter a shot. Or maybe you three are more concerned about payroll. I want answers. And I'm sure some fans will agree. I'm sure some fans will tear me apart as a whiner. But I DARE you to respond.


Nick


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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Wed Jan 30, 2008 10:49 pm

Manny is Super Bowl-bound


http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/extras/extra_bases/


Link Posted by Gordon Edes, Globe Staff January 30, 2008 01:40 PM

Just talked with Gene Matos, one of Manny Ramirez's agents. He said he was on his way to Arizona, where Manny has been working out at the Athletes Performance Institute, and that they were going to the Super Bowl.

"He's going to the game,'' Matos said. "The Patriots got him some tickets. I don't think he's ever been before.''

Ramirez is said to be in great shape this winter -- that's the word of Dustin Pedroia, who also has been at API -- and Matos described Manny as "fired up. I haven't seen him myself yet, but I know he's in great spirits. Heck, they just won the World Series.''

When I mentioned that I'd be arriving early for spring training, Matos laughed and said, "Maybe we'll convince Manny to come to camp early, too.''

Manny's arrivals in Fort Myers have become something of an annual event -- remember last year's antique car show hoohah? It will be interesting to see if Manny maintains the cheerful persona he exhibited so freely in the postseason, when he suddenly turned into a chatterbox and left us with the memorable "I'm a bad man" line after a game-winning home run in October.

As my colleague Nick Cafardo pointed out earlier this week, the Sox don't have to exercise the option on Manny's contract -- they hold a $20m option for both 2009 and 2010 -- until November, and won't be in any hurry to do so. But Manny, who needs just 10 home runs to reach 500 for his career, doesn't seem inclined to make the option an issue at this stage. He turns 36, by the way, on May 30.

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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Wed Jan 30, 2008 10:56 pm

Sweeny Blog: Did The Yankees Blow It?

Sweeny Murti


http://www.wfan.com/pages/1567205.php

I finally have an answer for you.

All winter long, everywhere I go, Yankee fans have been asking me the same question. "Are we getting Santana?" Of course, the answer now is no…he's going to be a Met.

Did the Yankees blow it? Only time will tell. Back in December they went back and forth without a unanimous decision on whether to go forward with the Hughes-Cabrera package. There were obvious merits to obtaining Santana, but some in the organization also felt strongly about holding onto Hughes and seeing their plan through to the end.

It's pretty clear now that the voices in favor of keeping Hughes were heard louder. If the Yankees wanted Santana, they would have him now…no doubt about that. But they decided their long-term future was better invested in Hughes, Chamberlain, and Kennedy. There is no doubting Santana's greatness. But Hughes is still the team's top pitching prospect and he's under control for 6 more years before he hits free agency.

Will the Yankees look back one day and regret not making this deal? There is no way of telling right now whether this Big 3 turns into another Hudson-Mulder-Zito or another Smoltz-Glavine-Avery. The Yankees just hope they don't turn into Pulsipher-Wilson-Isringhausen.

But for all you Yankee fans who have been preaching to me all winter how you didn't want to trade the kids, even if it meant not getting Santana…I don't want to hear you moaning to me next summer when Santana is mowing down the NL and telling me the Yankees should have made the deal. No looking back. The majority of fans told me all winter that they wanted to keep the young pitchers. Well now you have them, so let's see what you do with them…and no Monday morning quarterbacking.

* And now for that other question I've been hearing all winter. "You think the Yanks are gonna have a good year?"

Who am I, Carnac? Depends on your definition of "good year." If that means winning the World Series…personally, I don't think their pitching staff is experienced enough to take them to the World Series. But I probably would have said the same thing about the Marlins in 2003. Now…may a weird holy man drop a cactus down your shorts.

* If you didn't believe it before, you better believe it now. This is Brian Cashman's show. Cashman wanted Joe Girardi as his manager and he wanted to hold onto the young pitchers. Despite any genetic tendencies to overrule the GM and take a damn-the-consequences approach, Hank Steinbrenner has stayed true to Cashman's plan. If the plan doesn't end with the Yankees in the playoffs this year, then there will be some doubt as to whether Cashman gets to come back in 2009. But this is definitely his show in 2008. Hank Steinbrenner has been vocal, but he has not crushed any of Cashman's wishes to this point.

* The contract the Yankees gave Robinson Cano isn't major news in this Super Bowl/Santana week, but it is downright historic by Yankee standards. Cano will make $28 million over the next 4 years, a bargain rate should he continue to produce and improve. If the Yankees pick up his two option years after that, he will make a total of $57 million over the next 6 years.

The Yanks have never signed one of their own young players to a long-term deal this early in his career. They let Bernie Williams get to free agency. They signed Derek Jeter, Mariano Rivera, and Jorge Posada a year before they became free agents. Cano was not going to be a free agent for another four years.

I told Cano's agent, Bobby Barad, a year ago that he was never going to get Cano signed to a long-term deal. One, it wasn't the Yankees way of doing business, and two, the organization had too many concerns about Cano's work habits to risk making him comfortable with guaranteed money. I called Barad back this week to congratulate him on doing the impossible.

It's still a team friendly deal because the option years leave a carrot to dangle in front of Cano before free agency. Now we wait to see if after a few very promising years he turns into the hitter many feel he can be: Rod Carew with power.

* It was a treat to see Bernie Williams perform live for the first time…musically, I mean. Obviously, I have seen Bernie live on a baseball field many times before.

Last Saturday night, Bernie performed on stage during his charity fundraiser in New Rochelle, joined for one number on drums by guest of honor Paul O'Neill.

I had the pleasure of joining John Sterling in running the live auction. Great job by everyone there. It was a wonderful event to raise money for the Hillside Food Outreach, feeding many hungry families in Westchester. You can check them out at hillsidefoodoutreach.org.
* Two weeks away from pitchers and catchers. We'll talk to you (and blog to you) from Tampa then.

Thanks as always for reading. Send questions and comments to Yankees@wfan.com
.

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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Wed Jan 30, 2008 11:01 pm

Because Hank doesn't hate Mets than Stinking Redsox Smile

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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Wed Jan 30, 2008 11:03 pm

According to the Bergen Record's Bob Klapisch, the Twins came back to the Yankees with an offer of Johan Santana for Melky Cabrera, Ian Kennedy and a prospect on Monday, only to be turned down.
If true, the Yankees declined the chance to acquire Santana without giving up Phil Hughes or Joba Chamberlain. Klapisch also believes the Red Sox had both Jacoby Ellsbury and Jon Lester off the table by the time the Twins chose to accept the Mets' offer.
Source: Bergen Record


Three or four years ago I'd have been in here railing at the front office just like Tom Ricardo is doing. But, anyone who follows this team closely now knows that whether you think you agree or disagree with their decision, you can rest assured that they have analyzed all the options, run the numbers, consulted the scouts, and probably thought of numerous contingencies that haven't even crossed the mind of the most avid fan. It is such a reassuring feeling to be able to sit back and watch a premier player go to another team, while still having the confidence that the Red Sox did all they could and all they should to try to bring him to Boston on favorable terms for the Red Sox. Whatever those might have been. In the end, you just tip your cap to the front office for putting in the work on the deal, exhale a few times because he didn't go to the Yankees, a get ready for spring training.

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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Wed Jan 30, 2008 11:09 pm

Keith Law- Top five prospects by organization


http://insider.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?name=law_keith

Editor's Note: Keith Law will reveal his top 100 overall prospects on Thursday, and he listed his top five prospects by position on Tuesday.

Arizona

1. Jarrod Parker, rhp
2. Max Scherzer, rhp
3. Gerardo Parra, rf
4. Brooks Brown, rhp
5. Wes Roemer, rhp

Atlanta

1. Jordan Schafer, cf
2. Jason Heyward, rf
3. Tommy Hanson, rhp
4. Cole Rohrbough, lhp
5. Gorkys Hernandez, cf

Baltimore

1. Matt Wieters, c
2. Nolan Reimold, lf
3. Chorye Spoone, p
4. Radhames Liz, rhp
5. Troy Patton, lhp

Boston

1. Clay Buchholz, rhp
2. Jacoby Ellsbury, cf
3. Lars Anderson, 1b
4. Jed Lowrie, ss
5. Justin Masterson, rhp

Chicago Cubs

1. Josh Vitters, 3b
2. Geovany Soto, c
3. Sean Gallagher, rhp
4. Josh Donaldson, c
5. Jose Ceda, p

Chicago White Sox

1. Aaron Poreda, lhp
2. Nevin Griffith, rhp
3. Lance Broadway, rhp
4. Kyle McCulloch, rhp
5. John Shelby, of

Cincinnati

1. Jay Bruce, rf
2. Homer Bailey, rhp
3. Johnny Cueto, rhp
4. Joey Votto, 1b
5. Devin Mesoraco, c

Cleveland

1. Adam Miller, rhp
2. Nick Weglarz, lf/1b
3. Chuck Lofgren, lhp
4. Beau Mills, 1b
5. Wes Hodges, 3b

Colorado

1. Franklin Morales, lhp
2. Ian Stewart, 3b
3. Casey Weathers, rhp
4. Chris Nelson, ss
5. Hector Gomez, ss

Detroit

1. Rick Porcello, rhp
2. Cale Iorg, ss
3. Casey Crosby, lhp
4. Danny Worth, ss
5. Brandon Hamilton, rhp
Note: Crosby is expected to miss the 2008 season after undergoing Tommy John surgery.

Florida

1. Cameron Maybin, cf
2. Matt Dominguez, 3b
3. Chris Volstad, rhp
4. Gaby Hernandez, rhp
5. Brett Sinkbeil, rhp

Houston

1. J.R. Towles, c
2. Felipe Paulino, rhp
3. Brad James, rhp
4. Bud Norris, rhp
5. Mitch Einertson, rf

Kansas City

1. Mike Moustakas, ss
2. Dan Cortes, rhp
3. Luke Hochevar, rhp
4. Carlos Rosa, rhp
5. Danny Duffy, lhp

Los Angeles Angels

1. Nick Adenhart, rhp
2. Brandon Wood, 3b
3. Jordan Walden, rhp
4. Hank Conger, c
5. Matt Sweeney, 1b

Los Angeles Dodgers

1. Clayton Kershaw, lhp
2. Andy LaRoche, 3b
3. Chin-Lung Hu, ss
4. James McDonald, rhp
5. Chris Withrow, rhp

Milwaukee

1. Matt LaPorta, 1b
2. Manny Parra, lhp
3. Alcides Escobar, ss
4. Angel Salome, c
5. Jeremy Jeffress, rhp

Minnesota

1. Carlos Gomez, cf
2. Deolis Guerra, rhp
3. Tyler Robertson, lhp
4. Wilson Ramos, c
5. Philip Humber, rhp

New York Mets

1. Fernando Martinez, cf
2. Brant Rustich, rhp
3. Nathan Vineyard, lhp
4. Jon Niese, lhp
5. Mike Carp, 1b

New York Yankees

1. Joba Chamberlain, rhp
2. Jose Tabata, rf
3. Austin Jackson, cf
4. Ian Kennedy, rhp
5. Andrew Brackman, rhp

Oakland

1. Daric Barton, 1b
2. Carlos Gonzalez, cf
3. Fautino de los Santos, rhp
4. Trevor Cahill, rhp
5. Gio Gonzalez, lhp

Philadelphia

1. Carlos Carrasco, rhp
2. Joe Savery, lhp
3. Kyle Drabek, rhp
4. Josh Outman, lhp
5. Travis d'Arnaud, c

Pittsburgh

1. Andrew McCutchen, cf
2. Neil Walker, 3b
3. Brad Lincoln, rhp
4. Dan Moskos, lhp
5. Steve Pearce, 1b

San Diego

1. Chase Headley, 3b
2. Kyle Blanks, 1b
3. Matt Antonelli, 2b/cf
4. Matt Latos, rhp
5. Drew Miller, rhp

San Francisco

1. Angel Villalona, 1b
2. Tim Alderson, rhp
3. Henry Sosa, rhp
4. Wendell Fairley, rf
5. Madison Bumgarner, lhp

Seattle

1. Carlos Triunfel, ss
2. Jeff Clement, c
3. Wladimir Balentien, rf
4. Chris Tillman, rhp
5. Juan Ramirez, rhp

St. Louis

1. Colby Rasmus, cf
2. Mitch Boggs, rhp
3. Jaime Garcia, rhp
4. Bryan Anderson, c
5. Tyler Herron, rhp

Tampa Bay

1. Evan Longoria, 3b
2. Desmond Jennings, cf
3. Wade Davis, rhp
4. David Price, lhp
5. Jake McGee, lhp

Texas

1. Elvis Andrus, ss
2. Taylor Teagarden, c
3. Michael Main, rhp
4. German Duran, 2b
5. Eric Hurley, rhp

Toronto

1. Travis Snider, rf
2. Brett Cecil, lhp
3. Kevin Ahrens, 3b
4. Trystan Magnuson, rhp
5. J.P. Arencibia, c

Washington

1. Ross Detwiler, lhp
2. Chris Marrero, 1b
3. Jordan Zimmerman, rhp
4. Josh Smoker, lhp
5. Michael Burgess, rf

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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Wed Jan 30, 2008 11:19 pm

I think 3 will pan out... I see Humber being a bust. Mulvey I liked, Guerra I do not know much about and I saw Gomez and I think he is decent. You are telling me 3 serviceable pitchers potentially and an above average outfielder potentially are not a steal when regarding with the best pitcher in MLB? You have to give up stuff to get an ace caliber pitcher. The Mets gave up NOTHING literally to get him. There are grades of all those prospects and they are B to B minuses (I believe Humber might have been a C+ even)

I see Mulvey being a nice pitcher, Guerra is a question right now, way too far away, Humber I think is going to bust out, and Gomez could be good, but again Gomez is too far off. I think the Mets rushed Gomez.

The Twins blew it. They should have taken the Red Sox or Yankees offer because they were much better than the Mets.

But you know what screw it we have Santana and they don't. Take that nonbelievers!!! BOO YA!!!

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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Wed Jan 30, 2008 11:23 pm

Why the Mets didn't rip off Minesotta:

1. This is not a video game. Real life does not include a straight up talent trade in many of these high-profile trades. The Mets traded talent for talent + contract + personality.

2. The Twins screwed up. They really did. They blew their hands when they made it obvious that they had to trade him this winter. The blew their hand when they bluffed for more. They blew their hand when they resigned Morneau and Cuddyer. The Twins could have had more, but they made it so obvious that they had to make a trade.

3. There was no other fit for Santana. No small market team could afford him, especially considering that they had to give up their most valuable commodity, affordable talent, in exchange. The other big market teams did not have the financial flexibility nor the desire. Those teams also made strict stances on their top prospects, they were not moving them for a pitcher that would destroy their finances and add on to their revenue payments.

4. The Mets gave up a lot. The Mets gave up a practically major league ready center fielder who has a ceiling much higher than any of the other rumored outfield prospects (especially Cabrera). Gomez is going to be a name you will never forget. He will, despite how silly kyubi seemed, be a player of Reyes' caliber. He has a great, exciting personality and runs like wild. If I had to pick one player to compare Gomez to as an all around person/baseball player... Mike Cameron. He'll be a loved teammate, a great defender, and a 30/30 type hitter with high slugging and on-base abilities.

On top of that, Philip Humber projects very nicely (could be a lot like John Maine with his career path) and we all know of Mulvey's recent developments.

I guarantee that all four of these players make the majors. All four.



This was a very fair trade, and both teams did very well... but the Twins could have gotten more if they hadn't waited so long.





I don't know... they've shed salaries since Minaya came in, but they also brought in (and still have) these players:

-Beltran
-Martinez
-Delgado
-Wagner
-Santana

They were established stars and all on huge contracts.

The Mets mistakes over the last few years have included minor contracts that ended up being much more talented than the Mets assumed.

Omar said when he came aboard that he would try to bring in big talent to win a championship... right now he's done just that.


Strip out Santana and the salary additions have essentially been offset by salary reductions - going into this year, the payroll was lower than it was after 2002. And keep this in mind - apart from Santana who isyet to sign, half those names will be gone next year.

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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Thu Jan 31, 2008 8:50 am

Santana Extension Talk

There's still the little matter of the Mets signing Johan Santana to perhaps the largest deal ever for a pitcher. Let's explore.

* LEN3 said yesterday to expect an extension (starting with 2009) in the range of six years, $130MM. Remember, Santana is signed for 2008 at $13.25MM.
* Charley Walters expects a six-year deal worth more than $150MM (which would include a $7MM signing bonus and performance incentives).
* Sabernomics says Santana might be worth around $138MM over the 2009-14 seasons.
* What do you think? Take MLBTR's Johan Santana extension poll. Click here to see the results of this poll.

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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:08 am

Buster Olney- Scrutinizing the Santana deal


http://insider.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?name=olney_buster

Folks in the game love a big trade -- love dissecting it, love playing devil's advocate, love playing a little Monday morning quarterback, as if they had been involved. After a winter mostly filled with the Mitchell report and its hanging chads, they loved talking about the Santana trade.

The guesses of what the final number of Santana's contract extension is going to be ranged from $135 million, in total dollars (including the $13.25 million), to $148 million. My guess is that the total package, including the money owed to him, will hit $153 million. We'll see. Charley Walters writes that Santana will get more than $150 million (within the same piece, he writes that it wouldn't be surprising to see the Twins pursue Josh Fogg).

Most say this trade, if completed, makes the Mets the team to beat in the NL, and that Santana will be extraordinary. "You're talking about someone who could have a 2.10 ERA in the National League," said one AL executive. "He's that good, and now he doesn't have to deal with the Tigers and the Indians and all the AL East teams."

Suddenly, with one deal, the thin Mets' rotation now has some depth, and if Pedro Martinez doesn't bounce back in his second season after shoulder surgery, the Mets should still be fine. They have their anchor. Talked to one scout who predicted Santana could rack up as many as 25 wins next season.

The officials were split on whether Twins GM Billy Smith botched the negotiations, with some noting the fluid nature of the talks, the pressure of being faced with the decision on whether to trade the best pitcher on the planet in the first month on the job. Others believe that Smith overplayed his hand, with two saying that once they heard that the Yankees had added Phil Hughes to their offer of Melky Cabrera and two other prospects, they were certain that the Twins would bite, and acquire a centerpiece pitcher who one day has the promise to be a front-of-the-rotation guy.

Among almost a dozen executives from across the baseball spectrum, there is unanimity in this point: The offer that the Twins wound up taking from the Mets is markedly inferior to the deals offered by the Yankees and Red Sox in December. "The difference between Carlos Gomez and Phil Hughes," said one evaluator, "is like night and day."

The Twins tried to re-engage the Yankees Monday night, calling and asking, again, for Hughes to be in a package. The Yankees said no, and the Twins then asked, instead, for Chien-Ming Wang and Ian Kennedy, and the Yankees said no



From Idiot Mets fans thoughts on Hank comments on J?ohan

Comment by Steal Home Jose!
2008-01-31 08:11:10

This is one of my biggest fears as a Met fan. I don’t really want NEW Met fans. I want every Met fan to have “at least” suffered through the 90s with us. I don’t want Mets hats showing up all over the place just because we are “good” now. I live in Florida, so I can definitely notice the difference.
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Comment by gomets6091
2008-01-31 08:21:52

yea, I agree. I noticed even just in the last 2 years (well, until last September anyway), Mets hats started showing up a lot more than they did in the past. The absolute last thing I want is for us to turn into the Red Sox, with fake fans all across the country. Color me crazy, but I like being the underdog team with the smaller but more intense fanbase. That’s just who the Mets are.
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Comment by mr_met
2008-01-31 08:50:40

don’t even bother. casual fans are always going to be there regardless. and they will always come up to you and try to talk baseball when they can’t even name one pitcher out of “their team’s” rotation
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Comment by x-nady
2008-01-31 08:13:01

I love these disgusting caps Cerrone finds to represent the Braves, Phils, Yanks et al.
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Comment by Mingo
2008-01-31 08:15:56

I just wish that Matt would use eggs and shoes when he has a story on the Braves.
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Comment by cyclone
2008-01-31 08:51:19

This got the biggest laugh out of me.
(Comments wont nest below this level)
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Comment by mr_met
2008-01-31 08:41:31

i wonder if newera’s gon make that kind of hat for the mets
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Comment by skillsets
2008-01-31 08:57:41

That story about the Yankee cap is priceless.

By the way, here in the Philly area, where I’ve lived now for over 10 years, up until September 2007, you couldn’t find anyone out in public wearing a Phillies cap, other than if you actually went to a Phillies game. It’s always Eagles, Eagles, Eagles around here.

Then, for about 3 weeks, you couldn’t find anyone who WASN’T wearing a Phillies cap. Then, after the first week of October, if you walked around town, you wouldn’t even know the Phillies existed.

The other day when the Santana deal was announced, I turned on local sports talk radio, and rather than talking about the Super Bowl which is just days away, or the fact that the best pitcher on the planet had just been traded, they were talking about the Flyers coming out of the all star break! Unbelievable.

Philadelphia: the dumbest, most provincial, so-called “sports fans” on Earth.
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Comment by stickguy
2008-01-31 09:22:42

having lived in S. Jersey (just outside Philly) for about 20 years now, I second what Skillsets said. This area is all Eagles (oh sorry, Iggles!) all the time. Phils gear is uncommon.

They do have a really nice stadium though.
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Comment by The Captain
2008-01-31 09:00:41

Hot stove NY reported yesterday that Smith went to the Yankees with an offer of Santana for Kennedy/Cabrera before this Met trade was complete and Yankees still declined.
My guess is that the Yankees payroll were simply ridiculous already and embarassing. Thank you A Rod for being such a team player and restructuring your contract.
The 08 PAtriots, the best football team of all time. Why because one of the best QB’s in Tom Brady took an unselfish pay cut inorder for management to construct this great team. Thank you A Rod for not being a Met.
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Comment by Magooley
2008-01-31 09:23:28

So it had nothing to do with like the other twenty guys on the Yankees that make 14 million + ? It was all A-rod?

The Yankee payroll is an abomination — but it’s not all because of A-rod.
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Comment by The Captain
2008-01-31 09:38:10

So one could also thank Cashman too, however I just hate A Rod’s attitude, (well I guess its not his fault to non detectable illegal substances effects behavior)
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Comment by cmon_mets08
2008-01-31 09:25:53

If Hank speaks, and there are no reporters listening, does he make a sound?

WOW, what’s up with that hat?
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Comment by andyglass1
2008-01-31 10:24:02

…i love it…he just can’t say, ‘no comment,’ can he…he tried…give him credit…but he had to continue…he just can’t help himself…i love it…

With regards to cranky Hank’s comment, I would have to say it was the most respectable / honest thing he could say. If he does say no comment, then clearly he is being resentful / jealous and cant acknowledge what the rival team has accomplished. If he says oh the price was ridiculous or we didnt need that guy, then he is obviously just bs’ing. If he says MN were idiots, they got ripped off, then he is again being a sore loser.

Hank will undoubtedly give us, or any non-Yankee fans plenty of quotes to laugh about and delight in his insanity. This really wasnt one of them. He was probably asked for comments, with the hopes he lose it.
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Comment by kbh218
2008-01-31 10:44:28

You’re missing the point. He starts out by saying that he can’t comment but then comments with the very next sentence. The guy is an idiot. If I were a Yankees fan, having a buffoon like this guy running the organization would scare the hell out of me. As a Mets fan, it is pure entertainment.
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Comment by The Captain
2008-01-31 09:30:44

Here’s an article in Mets Mole titled “Omar bends Bill Smith over”

Thank god The Boss stepped aside and let his two retarded sons take over the reigns in Yankee-Land…because there’s no way in hell he would have let Omar rape Bill Smith and the Twins like the Metsies did this afternoon. The Mets and Twinkies agreed on a deal today that, pending a contract extension in the next 72 hours, will send Johan Santana to Queens for Carlos Gomez, Phil Humber, Kevin Mulvey, and Deolis Guerra.

Omar Minaya singlehandedly achieved legendary status in Queens by completing this deal for the greatest pitcher on the planet. The two-time Cy Young-winner is about to enter his prime, and has several Cy Young seasons left in him. This deal makes up for the Kazmir-Zambrano trade, it makes up trading Nolan Ryan, it makes up for trading Jeff Kent for Carlos Baerga, it makes up for not signing Vladimir Guerrero, it makes up for not trading Alex Escobar and Jay Payton for Gary Sheffield. And most of all, it makes up for last year’s epic collapse.

Today is the best day in Mets history since clinching the World Series in ‘86.

This is so comical I love it
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Comment by Cheese
2008-01-31 09:44:14

Mets fans would give their left nut to have that kind of fandom.
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Comment by metsknight
2008-01-31 10:39:24

not only this… but when the mets are in the playoffs and the yankees are out… every single yankee fan says i root for the mets when the yankees are out… thanks but no thanks… dont know a single me fan that would say i root for the yankees when were out.
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Comment by GravediggerHebner
2008-01-31 10:51:54

I’m prepared to be banned for perceived racism but anyway here goes.

Was the guy with the hat African-American?

I am not, but on the occasions that I have enjoyed sitting and watching latenight comedy shows on BET I inevitably see an African-American comedian say something like this:

“If you see me wearing a Cleveland Browns jersey, don’t come up and high-five me saying ‘Go Browns.’ I don’t like the Browns, I like the shirt!”
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Last edited by on Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:17 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:10 am

Jan 31, 2008 8:02 am - Buzz: Mets Remain Confident in Talks


http://www.metsblog.com/



...posted by Matthew Cerrone...

According to multiple reports, including this site, the Mets remain confident that a contract will be worked out with Johan Santana before Friday’s 5 pm deadline.

…from what i can gather, Omar Minaya, Jeff Wilpon and John Ricco met with santana’s agents most of the day and through the evening yesterday in New York City…

According to the Pioneer Press, the Mets and Santana’s agent discussed a six-year deal worth more than $150 million, including a $7 million signing bonus and performance incentives.

…as i wrote last night, i believe the final hurdle most likely deals with the seventh-year of the contract, and whether it must be guaranteed or be an easily attained option…my bet is it ends up being an option, but time will tell…

In Newsday, according to Ken Davidoff, Minaya has told ‘industry friends’ that he is ‘at peace’ with what Santana and his agents are likely to request.

…well wouldn’t omar have to be…

…i mean, you, me, my grandmother, and more or less every one else knew what it was going to cost…i’m sure omar did as well…he never would have pulled the trigger on the deal, only to raise everyone’s hopes, only to have the transaction ‘collapse,’ so he could spend the next few months cleaning egg off his face










Buzz: Mets Remain Confident in Talks

According to multiple reports, including this site, the Mets remain confident that a contract will be worked out with Johan Santana before Friday’s 5 pm deadline.

…from what i can gather, Omar Minaya, Jeff Wilpon and John Ricco met with santana’s agents most of the day and through the evening yesterday in New York City…

According to the Pioneer Press, the Mets and Santana’s agent discussed a six-year deal worth more than $150 million, including a $7 million signing bonus and performance incentives.

…as i wrote last night, i believe the final hurdle most likely deals with the seventh-year of the contract, and whether it must be guaranteed or be an easily attained option…my bet is it ends up being an option, but time will tell…

In Newsday, according to Ken Davidoff, Minaya has told ‘industry friends’ that he is ‘at peace’ with what Santana and his agents are likely to request.

…well wouldn’t omar have to be…

…i mean, you, me, my grandmother, and more or less every one else knew what it was going to cost…i’m sure omar did as well…he never would have pulled the trigger on the deal, only to raise everyone’s hopes, only to have the transaction ‘collapse,’ so he could spend the next few months cleaning egg off his face…
Posted in Johan Santana, Mets Rumors on January 31st, 2008
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58 Comments »
Comment by Pedro
2008-01-31 08:07:37

Lets get this done already!
If this deal is not completed by tomorrow morning, I`m going to be getting very anxious.
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Comment by gowrightgo
2008-01-31 08:31:23

Dont worry….it goes down today and we are all sitting pretty tonight with a new ace at the top of the rotation and cold one in our hands watching the details scroll across SNY or
ESPN ticker
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Comment by FBones24
2008-01-31 09:50:08

yeahhh…probably SNY. I’m turned off by ESPN right now.
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Comment by bigchart333
2008-01-31 08:12:06

i wonder if it’ll go 7 years or not, even with or without an option…that’s A LOT, but u know what? for what we gave up, who cares…it seems more “fair” to sign him to a 10 year contract haha
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Comment by gowrightgo
2008-01-31 08:33:58

I’m with you. The talent cost in the deal was so fair that the cost in $$ or years should not be a major hurdle. The Wilpons are loving this press and I am sure that tix sales are going bananas right now. He will pay for himself in the way that Pedro did. He will add credibility, recruiting power, and ticket sales in addition to his performance which should be amazin. Also….Playoff baseball is pure profit from the mgt perspective so a deep run that ends in the World Series where the MEts get at least a few home games would be major infusion of new $$
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Comment by GetsByBuckner415
2008-01-31 09:12:31

He has already started paying for himself…upon word of the trade I called up the Mets Ticket Office and re-upped my 4 seat 7-game pack - I dropped a grand already and he is technically not even a Met yet.

So yes Johan will pay foe himself…not to mention walk up sales on days that he pitches.
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Comment by kowalski69
2008-01-31 09:19:21

how mad will you be if you don’t get to see him pitch on those 7 games?

Comment by Hit The Weights Zeile
2008-01-31 09:25:40

i think the deal will get done but its the mets so they can never make anything easy for us.

Comment by GetsByBuckner415
2008-01-31 09:28:58

I won’t be mad, I will walk up at some point and get to see him pitch…but that was not the point of buying the tickets…i was not re-upping my tix unless the Mets gave me a reason to…with this trade they gave me a reason and I am showing my support.

Comment by Blue_n_Orange
2008-01-31 09:29:03

I feel as though we acquired him for such a modest price trade-wise that I’d almost feel guilty about not overpaying the guy Wink

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Comment by lefty
2008-01-31 08:20:20

Anyone worried that a pitcher that relies on just two pitches might not last as long as a pitcher that has a more varied arsenal. How will Santana do when he’s 32 or 33 and his fastball is 89-91. The change up ain’t gonna be that problematic. Don’t get me wrong, I like the trade but by year 5, let alone year 7 we migh be paying a lot of money for long reliever.
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Comment by cb32
2008-01-31 08:28:04

In actuality he is a 3 pitch pitcher. And we are not talking about three plus pitches, we are talking some of the best 3 pitches in baseball. His fastball is 95, the changeup has amazing movement making it more than just fooling the hitter based on the differential on speed, and his slider is also a strikeout pitch which may be the closest to ONLY being a plus pitch.

It is a valid point you bring up but the guy knows how to pitch. Besides, isn’t there a two pitch pitcher who never threw 95 that we just let go? He turned out ok.
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Comment by gowrightgo
2008-01-31 08:35:49

I am not worried about his performance dropping off the radar at 33 yrs old and 4 yrs into this 6 or 7 yr deal.
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Comment by Hit The Weights Zeile
2008-01-31 09:40:20

lefty i wouldnt worry about that too much. most great pitchers find a way around their declining stuff later on in their careers. look at pedro, hes throwing 86-88 and that changeup still fools people, and badly. its not how fast your fastball is as long as your mechanics are sound and the deception is their the changeup will be effective.

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Comment by VCarver
2008-01-31 08:45:47

I would not be particularly upset if by the back-end of Santana’s new contract he is no longer the ace he is now. That’s the risk and the price you have to be willing to pay with long contracts to premium players. And that will not mean the contract won’t have been worth it. I liken it to Mike Piazza’s contract. I would do that one a hundred times over, even though he was only worth $13 million/year for 4 of those 7 years. The quality years alone, as well as the thrills and chills he produced were worth it.

I think it’s likely Santana will no longer be an ace during the last few years of his new contract, and that’s OK, as long as he lives up to the first part of the contract He can even get hurt at that point and it wouldn’t make the contract necessarily bad. I also think that Santana has a good chance of being able to adjust his pitching in 3-4 years when his fastball loses steam. Maybe The Jacket will still be here and can help him adjust the way he helped Glavine.
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Comment by krumbledkookie
2008-01-31 09:47:04

Like was already commented, Santana’s got three pitches which he can strike you out with. Beyond that, he is a phenomenal athlete that keeps himself in outstanding shape. And as I’ve said before, his motion is mechanically perfect and effortless. He won’t get hurt, at least not doing baseball activities (we just need to keep him out of NYC cabs), and I think most experts would agree that his very likely to perform as well at 34 or 35 as he does now in his prime. In other words, his prime will last longer than most due to his beautiful mechanics.
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Comment by Innis_2_winnis
2008-01-31 08:30:24

Seemed to work ok for Glavine, who has managed to win over 300 games without even throwing in the high 80s or having a real third pitch (50 mph euphus curve notwithstanding). Jaimie Moyer on the Phils is also mostly a 2 pitch pitcher (bp fastball and brutal change). Not that I want to see Johan degrade to a slop-baller later in this contract…not at all…but pitchers with solid changeups tend to have fairly good staying power. Sign him for 5, option for 6, with plenty of incentive escalators (210 ip, 20 wins, all-star, cy young, mvp, playoffs, ws etc.)
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Comment by mr_met
2008-01-31 08:31:06

my grandma says ‘git it done already.’ she also wonders if we’re still after a-rod
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Comment by Son of Choo Choo Coleman
2008-01-31 08:31:44

The Mets have won exactly two world series in their 43 year history. In both cases, they had a dominant Cy Young pitcher -
Seaver in 69 and Gooden in 86. Now that they have another potential Cy Young winner, they’ve got a great chance of winning another title. That is how much Santana is worth to this team.
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Comment by bustamets07
2008-01-31 08:42:37

Santana throws a NASTY slider also
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Comment by gottabelieve07
2008-01-31 09:14:46

Anyone who questions whether Santana is worth paying in terms of money and years is incredibly myopic.

If the best pitcher in baseball, in his prime, is not worth bending arbitrary rules to sign, then no one in the game is worth signing at all.

And winning wouldn’t matter either.

Sign the man. Give him his money.
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Comment by therealsince86
2008-01-31 09:26:38

Maybe it’s because everyone is so used to the Mets signing aging veterans? How long did we go on Pedro’s contract, 4 years at age 32. That was with Pedro already showing signs of injury. I don’t see the difference in going 7 years for Johan at age 29. Maybe the insurance part but I am sure they could get 4-5 years of that contract insured.
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Comment by ravi3
2008-01-31 09:54:59

In the case of Pedro, he has had this tear in his shoulder since 2001…Now that he had the surgery to repair it, who knows what he will be able to do..
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Comment by bobabouy01
2008-01-31 10:30:51

I can’t wait to see what Petey brings to the table this year….I think we’re going to have 2 aces at the top of the rotation.

Remember, Pedro doesn’t HAVE to throw gas anymore…he knows how to get people out WITHOUT having to dial it up into the high 90’s all the time…..but as we saw at the end of last year, he can still hit it when he needs to !!

I haven’t been this pumped up for a season to start in YEARS !!!! GO METS !!!!

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Comment by therealsince86
2008-01-31 09:19:10

I can’t understand why people are so concerned over the length of the contract. It will be a bargin in the long run. Santana if we only signed him to a 5 year contract would only be 34 at its end and would cost us way over 30 million to resign a pitcher whow would still be in his mid 30’s. Sign him the 7 years and get it over with, there is just as much of a chance that he is a great pitcher at age 36 as there is that he won’t be. Roll the dice and it could pay big money in the end.
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Comment by metzor
2008-01-31 09:26:03

That makes sense, except for the insurance thing. They won’t get him insured if its for 7 years, and if he’s injured for a season, that’s $20 million dollars down the drain.
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Comment by therealsince86
2008-01-31 09:28:15

What’s 20 million among friends and the Mets? But that being said, could we not get the 1st 5 years insured and only be on the hook for the last 2?
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Comment by metzor
2008-01-31 09:35:05

I’m sure the Mets FO is better at this stuff than I am, but those 2 years I’m assuming will be when he’s at his most injury prone out all those years.

I’m with you, I say just get it done what with the great bargain in players we’re getting him for. But 5 years from now if he’s injured plus uninsured we will be singing a different tune (unless we’ve won 2 or 3 WS by then, of course)

Comment by therealsince86
2008-01-31 09:40:03

How much as Pedro’s contract hurt us? He has not really pitched for us that much since signing his contract yet he has earned his pay check in many other ways.

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Comment by kowalski69
2008-01-31 09:22:44

He’s 28 now, going to be 29 this season. He started pitching in the majors in 2000. We’re going to control him for 7 years, during his best years… If we win a WS title and he breaks some records, you think he’d go to the HOF as a Met? Maybe retire 57 on the left field wall?
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Comment by m00kie
2008-01-31 09:30:17

cart before the horse at all?
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Comment by kowalski69
2008-01-31 09:31:27

i hit the ground running
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Comment by ravi3
2008-01-31 09:56:08

plus Johan has only been a full time starter since what..2002 or 2003?
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Comment by The Captain
2008-01-31 09:25:00

Here’s an article in Mets Mole titled
“Omar bends Bill Smith over”
Thank god The Boss stepped aside and let his two retarded sons take over the reigns in Yankee-Land…because there’s no way in hell he would have let Omar rape Bill Smith and the Twins like the Metsies did this afternoon. The Mets and Twinkies agreed on a deal today that, pending a contract extension in the next 72 hours, will send Johan Santana to Queens for Carlos Gomez, Phil Humber, Kevin Mulvey, and Deolis Guerra.


Hey Matt, you mave have heard this, but metsblog.com was referenced by Baseball Tonight coordinating producer Gus Ramsey on Bill Simmons’ BS report podcast on ESPN.com. The reference was about the confidence rating spike, and Ramsey basically opened with it during the interview. I believed he called metsblog.com an outstanding resource for mets fans. You’re blowing up!
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Comment by MetLifer
2008-01-31 10:11:16

Yeah.. MetsBlog is even starting to be a source of news information for RotoWorld!
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Last edited by on Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:13 am; edited 1 time in total

RedMagma

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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:10 am

Quote: Hank’s No Comment

By the way, Yankees VP Hank Steinbrenner had the following to say about the trade, as quoted by the Associated Press…

“I can’t really comment because it’s not done. All I can say is that the Twins did what they had to do. I hope it works out well for them. The Mets made a good trade from their end. Hopefully it works out for both teams.”

…i love it…he just can’t say, ‘no comment,’ can he…he tried…give him credit…but he had to continue…he just can’t help himself…i love it…
…by the way, i was in the elevator the other day with two guys…one of them was holding a Yankees hat…the other man said, “Yeah, I’m a Yankees fan too,” to which the guy holding the hat said, “Oh, I don’t know, I’m not really a baseball fan, it’s just a hat I wear,” and i laughed out loud…priceless






From Idiot Mets fans thoughts on Hank comments on J?ohan

Comment by Steal Home Jose!
2008-01-31 08:11:10

This is one of my biggest fears as a Met fan. I don’t really want NEW Met fans. I want every Met fan to have “at least” suffered through the 90s with us. I don’t want Mets hats showing up all over the place just because we are “good” now. I live in Florida, so I can definitely notice the difference.
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Comment by gomets6091
2008-01-31 08:21:52

yea, I agree. I noticed even just in the last 2 years (well, until last September anyway), Mets hats started showing up a lot more than they did in the past. The absolute last thing I want is for us to turn into the Red Sox, with fake fans all across the country. Color me crazy, but I like being the underdog team with the smaller but more intense fanbase. That’s just who the Mets are.
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Comment by mr_met
2008-01-31 08:50:40

don’t even bother. casual fans are always going to be there regardless. and they will always come up to you and try to talk baseball when they can’t even name one pitcher out of “their team’s” rotation
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Comment by x-nady
2008-01-31 08:13:01

I love these disgusting caps Cerrone finds to represent the Braves, Phils, Yanks et al.
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Comment by Mingo
2008-01-31 08:15:56

I just wish that Matt would use eggs and shoes when he has a story on the Braves.
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Comment by cyclone
2008-01-31 08:51:19

This got the biggest laugh out of me.
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Comment by mr_met
2008-01-31 08:41:31

i wonder if newera’s gon make that kind of hat for the mets
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Comment by skillsets
2008-01-31 08:57:41

That story about the Yankee cap is priceless.

By the way, here in the Philly area, where I’ve lived now for over 10 years, up until September 2007, you couldn’t find anyone out in public wearing a Phillies cap, other than if you actually went to a Phillies game. It’s always Eagles, Eagles, Eagles around here.

Then, for about 3 weeks, you couldn’t find anyone who WASN’T wearing a Phillies cap. Then, after the first week of October, if you walked around town, you wouldn’t even know the Phillies existed.

The other day when the Santana deal was announced, I turned on local sports talk radio, and rather than talking about the Super Bowl which is just days away, or the fact that the best pitcher on the planet had just been traded, they were talking about the Flyers coming out of the all star break! Unbelievable.

Philadelphia: the dumbest, most provincial, so-called “sports fans” on Earth.
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Comment by stickguy
2008-01-31 09:22:42

having lived in S. Jersey (just outside Philly) for about 20 years now, I second what Skillsets said. This area is all Eagles (oh sorry, Iggles!) all the time. Phils gear is uncommon.

They do have a really nice stadium though.
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Comment by The Captain
2008-01-31 09:00:41

Hot stove NY reported yesterday that Smith went to the Yankees with an offer of Santana for Kennedy/Cabrera before this Met trade was complete and Yankees still declined.
My guess is that the Yankees payroll were simply ridiculous already and embarassing. Thank you A Rod for being such a team player and restructuring your contract.
The 08 PAtriots, the best football team of all time. Why because one of the best QB’s in Tom Brady took an unselfish pay cut inorder for management to construct this great team. Thank you A Rod for not being a Met.
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Comment by Magooley
2008-01-31 09:23:28

So it had nothing to do with like the other twenty guys on the Yankees that make 14 million + ? It was all A-rod?

The Yankee payroll is an abomination — but it’s not all because of A-rod.
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Comment by The Captain
2008-01-31 09:38:10

So one could also thank Cashman too, however I just hate A Rod’s attitude, (well I guess its not his fault to non detectable illegal substances effects behavior)
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Comment by cmon_mets08
2008-01-31 09:25:53

If Hank speaks, and there are no reporters listening, does he make a sound?

WOW, what’s up with that hat?
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Comment by andyglass1
2008-01-31 10:24:02

…i love it…he just can’t say, ‘no comment,’ can he…he tried…give him credit…but he had to continue…he just can’t help himself…i love it…

With regards to cranky Hank’s comment, I would have to say it was the most respectable / honest thing he could say. If he does say no comment, then clearly he is being resentful / jealous and cant acknowledge what the rival team has accomplished. If he says oh the price was ridiculous or we didnt need that guy, then he is obviously just bs’ing. If he says MN were idiots, they got ripped off, then he is again being a sore loser.

Hank will undoubtedly give us, or any non-Yankee fans plenty of quotes to laugh about and delight in his insanity. This really wasnt one of them. He was probably asked for comments, with the hopes he lose it.
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Comment by kbh218
2008-01-31 10:44:28

You’re missing the point. He starts out by saying that he can’t comment but then comments with the very next sentence. The guy is an idiot. If I were a Yankees fan, having a buffoon like this guy running the organization would scare the h*ll out of me. As a Mets fan, it is pure entertainment.
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Comment by The Captain
2008-01-31 09:30:44

Here’s an article in Mets Mole titled “Omar bends Bill Smith over”

Thank god The Boss stepped aside and let his two retarded sons take over the reigns in Yankee-Land…because there’s no way in h*ll he would have let Omar r*pe Bill Smith and the Twins like the Metsies did this afternoon. The Mets and Twinkies agreed on a deal today that, pending a contract extension in the next 72 hours, will send Johan Santana to Queens for Carlos Gomez, Phil Humber, Kevin Mulvey, and Deolis Guerra.

Omar Minaya singlehandedly achieved legendary status in Queens by completing this deal for the greatest pitcher on the planet. The two-time Cy Young-winner is about to enter his prime, and has several Cy Young seasons left in him. This deal makes up for the Kazmir-Zambrano trade, it makes up trading Nolan Ryan, it makes up for trading Jeff Kent for Carlos Baerga, it makes up for not signing Vladimir Guerrero, it makes up for not trading Alex Escobar and Jay Payton for Gary Sheffield. And most of all, it makes up for last year’s epic collapse.

Today is the best day in Mets history since clinching the World Series in ‘86.

This is so comical I love it
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Comment by Cheese
2008-01-31 09:44:14

Mets fans would give their left nut to have that kind of fandom.
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Comment by metsknight
2008-01-31 10:39:24

not only this… but when the mets are in the playoffs and the yankees are out… every single yankee fan says i root for the mets when the yankees are out… thanks but no thanks… dont know a single me fan that would say i root for the yankees when were out.
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Comment by GravediggerHebner
2008-01-31 10:51:54

I’m prepared to be banned for perceived racism but anyway here goes.

Was the guy with the hat African-American?

I am not, but on the occasions that I have enjoyed sitting and watching latenight comedy shows on BET I inevitably see an African-American comedian say something like this:

“If you see me wearing a Cleveland Browns jersey, don’t come up and high-five me saying ‘Go Browns.’ I don’t like the Browns, I like the shirt!”

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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:13 am

Omar Minaya singlehandedly achieved legendary status in Queens by completing this deal for the greatest pitcher on the planet. The two-time Cy Young-winner is about to enter his prime, and has several Cy Young seasons left in him. This deal makes up for the Kazmir-Zambrano trade, it makes up trading Nolan Ryan, it makes up for trading Jeff Kent for Carlos Baerga, it makes up for not signing Vladimir Guerrero, it makes up for not trading Alex Escobar and Jay Payton for Gary Sheffield. And most of all, it makes up for last year’s epic collapse.

Today is the best day in Mets history since clinching the World Series in ‘86.

This is such a comical articl, I love it
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Comment by mouserdz
2008-01-31 09:37:21

I’m as excited as the next guy about this trade. But let history play out a bit, before talking about this trade in a historical sense. Santana better bring a ring to town, if we’re going to rank it above the Piazza deal. If he blows out his arm in year 1 of his contract, it isn’t any better than the Frank Viola trade.
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Comment by marylandmet
2008-01-31 09:27:06

Omar and the Wilpons had to know the general framework of a contract regarding Santana. I doubt they’ve been surprised at how much this deal is going to cost them in either money or years. This trade is so much more than just what Santana brings to the mound. It’s also a statement much like the trade for Piazza and the signing of Pedro Martinez. Piazza ushered in hope and excitement for the Mets after almost a decade of futility. Martinez announced to New Yorkers and the baseball world that Omar meant business about making this a first class franchise. Santana reinforces Omar’s commitment to make the Mets both a championship caliber team and a respected organization.
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Comment by bonatom
2008-01-31 09:28:53

To be fair Cerrone… Your grandmother is pretty well tapped into baseball brass
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Comment by stickguy
2008-01-31 09:29:52

It’s only money now. And the Mets should have plenty of that!

It will be expensive, but say he is Cy Young worthy for 3 years, years 4-5 very good (say a solid 3+ or a 2, maybe like Pedro on the Mets), and years 6-7 he tails off a bit but is still a better than average 4/5 rotation guy.

Based on his age, that would be a somewhat normal progression. And he would likely still be worth every penny!

another key will be having 1 or 2 guys from the minors on the team by 2009. Maybe Martinez takes over for Alou, saving more $$
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Comment by therealsince86
2008-01-31 09:38:23

Question you have to ask is with players like Loshe and Silva looking for 12 million a year today, how much will fringe players be looking for in 4 years? At least 20 million? I would expect Johan at age 33 to be better than Silva? I expect Johan at the end of his contract and 36 years old to be better than Loshe.

Also, remember that Glavine was being ask to be our #1 last year.
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Comment by The Captain
2008-01-31 09:46:12

one of many great point’s by the real.
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Comment by DWright is King
2008-01-31 09:33:25

story about santana’s humble beginnings as right-handed shortstop:

nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/mets/2008/01/31/2008-01-31_johan_santana_from_humble_beginnings_to_-2.html
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Comment by Hit The Weights Zeile
2008-01-31 09:44:26

QUICK everyone go buy a fanwalk brick so we can give santana that last guaranteed year and get this done.
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Comment by mrose
2008-01-31 10:32:28

only about $30 of those bricks went to the mets, rest went to charity, thanks for tryin!
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Comment by Pedro
2008-01-31 09:44:37

The Question is: How does the current contract of Johan (hopefully) affect the way the Mets approach next year’s off-season?? Do they become cheap b/c of this deal?I guess not being the fact that Citifield is set to open that year, but its going to be a wild off-season. We’ll be losing Delgado, Alou, Pedro, Duque, Perez, and possibally others that I`m not thinking about. How do you see next off-season working out?
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Comment by Hit The Weights Zeile
2008-01-31 09:57:14

i think we need to resign perez and we’ll probably need another pitcher since we’ll be losing 2, and id love for them to make a run at tex or dunn for 1st base to replace delgado. but lets not think about this stuff bc its a LONG ways away.
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Comment by gowrightgo
2008-01-31 10:01:20

Even with Santana and his big salary, we will be losing $15M in Delgado (might actually be more this year as it was all backloaded money), $15M in Pedro, $8M in Alou, $6M in Duque.

Assume we re-up OP for $15M per and $5m in other guys jumps in salary and $20M for Santana.

We would still be about $4M less than this years payroll. No reason payroll can not bump signficantly to accomodate another $40M spread around between 1 big time pitcher and 1 big time 1b or LF (wherever Fmart does not go)

We are in very good payroll shape going forward i think
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Comment by ravi3
2008-01-31 10:02:02

LOT of $$ coming off the books next year Delgado for sure, who is pulling in between $15-$20 mill, assume Alou will be done as well…I think the Mets will resign Perez, but Pedro remains up in the air…if he has a good season, will he want to pitch again? If so, I would think that Omar would re-up with him as well….You’ve got a potential in house replacement for both Alou and Duque, in F-Mart and Pelfrey…big savings from that…with the glaring hole we will have in both the 1b and cleanup spot, Mark Teixiera would sure sound good……
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Comment by RunReyesRun
2008-01-31 10:15:49

My take is that between Delgado, Pedro, Alou, Perez and El Duqe coming off, that’s almost $50 million off the books. Who do you resign? I say you lock up Ollie for 4 years $52 million ($13MM/year), Pedro for a year with an performance based option at $10MM (if all goes well this year ) and let El Duque and Alou head off to play dominoes in retirement. You need a first baseman and the only other legit option is Big Tex but he’ll get a 5/90 deal somewhere. I hate to say this but maybe we bring Delgado back on a short term deal similar to Pedro’s. That leaves LF where the OF free agents are Ibanez, Dunn, Burrell (no way), and others with team/player options - Vlad, Manny, Crawford, Baldelli so they’re most likely off the board. I don’t think they’ll commit to anyone long term out there because of the arrival of F-Mart but Ibanez will be 37 this time next year so I can see them going after a guy like although I would love Carl Crawford. If this all plays out I see the ‘09 rotation with John, Pedro, Ollie, Maine, and Pelfrey 1-5 and a payroll about the same as ‘08 since I think DWright and Reyes both get good bumps that year.
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Comment by therealsince86
2008-01-31 10:42:58

I was looking at Delgado’s contract. He has a 16 million dollar team option for 09. Before we go jumping up and down that we wont use it, it has a 4 million dollar buy out so its really a 12 million dollar contract. If Delgado hits .270 30+ 100+ it will be very difficult to find that production at 1B for only 12 million a year. I would say that we should go for Tex but Delgado would not be a bad option on a 1 year with an option contract IF he bounces back this year. If not, I would look to get Nick Johnson from the Nats or Kendry Morales from the Angels. Both are currently blocked and would provide a decent bat lower in the order.
I think we we resign Pedro and Perez to be starters and maybe even Elduque if he agrees to go to the pen.
Pedro will come back on a 2 year deal with a couple of options like what we did with an aging Glavine. Perez if we want to keep him needs to be resigned by the Allstar break. Offer him the same contract that Silva got.
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Comment by Pedro
2008-01-31 10:59:03

If we can’t sign Perez, maybe the Mets go after Sabbathia, though I can absolutely see the Yankees throwing a ridiculous amount of money at him. Plus hes not exactly in the best shape.

1st base will be very interesting. Delgado may have a decent 2008 season, but hes too inconsistent and I would prefer that the Mets let him walk, even if he does have a decent year. He is in steady decline, and by 2009 he may only be capable of hitting 18-20 homers, add in the horrendous defense (likely to get worse with age) and he is not an ideal candidate.

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Comment by MetLifer
2008-01-31 09:54:56

Speaking of money… Do you know who is the richest owner in baseball? The Twins owner is! LOL.. About 1 billion dollars richer than the next richest owner. Wilpon isn’t even in the top 5.. and we call him cheap.. haha
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Comment by mexfan
2008-01-31 10:04:25


Comment by yoyotime
2008-01-31 10:10:01

metsblog is obviously popular, but if I have to read another report prefaced by, “From what i can gather…” i think i’m going to kill myself.

we get it matt, you gather information, you don’t need to begin every….single….freakin….post with “from what i gather.” We know everything you write is information from other people/sources and have no unique vantage points. do yourself a favor and stop using this annoying phrase 93 times a day.

hope this helps.
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Comment by Magooley
2008-01-31 10:25:30

Yeah, I’m sure that will help.
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Comment by bobabouy01
2008-01-31 10:35:41

Wow….and I thought my wife *itched about “nothing”. Thanks for putting it all in perspective !
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Comment by WozzyBearRU
2008-01-31 10:41:18

Get it Done! Get it Done! Get it Done!
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Comment by tfc3rid
2008-01-31 10:50:32

I think it will get done but I’m getting nervous… We will NEVER get this opportunity again with Santana because should we not agree, I think the Twins will want Fernando Martinez…
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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:18 am

Scrutinizing the Santana deal



http://insider.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?name=olney_buster





posted: Thursday, January 31, 2008 | Feedback | Print Entry
filed under: MLB

Folks in the game love a big trade -- love dissecting it, love playing devil's advocate, love playing a little Monday morning quarterback, as if they had been involved. After a winter mostly filled with the Mitchell report and its hanging chads, they loved talking about the Santana trade.

The guesses of what the final number of Santana's contract extension is going to be ranged from $135 million, in total dollars (including the $13.25 million), to $148 million. My guess is that the total package, including the money owed to him, will hit $153 million. We'll see. Charley Walters writes that Santana will get more than $150 million (within the same piece, he writes that it wouldn't be surprising to see the Twins pursue Josh Fogg).

Most say this trade, if completed, makes the Mets the team to beat in the NL, and that Santana will be extraordinary. "You're talking about someone who could have a 2.10 ERA in the National League," said one AL executive. "He's that good, and now he doesn't have to deal with the Tigers and the Indians and all the AL East teams."

Suddenly, with one deal, the thin Mets' rotation now has some depth, and if Pedro Martinez doesn't bounce back in his second season after shoulder surgery, the Mets should still be fine. They have their anchor. Talked to one scout who predicted Santana could rack up as many as 25 wins next season.

The officials were split on whether Twins GM Billy Smith botched the negotiations, with some noting the fluid nature of the talks, the pressure of being faced with the decision on whether to trade the best pitcher on the planet in the first month on the job. Others believe that Smith overplayed his hand, with two saying that once they heard that the Yankees had added Phil Hughes to their offer of Melky Cabrera and two other prospects, they were certain that the Twins would bite, and acquire a centerpiece pitcher who one day has the promise to be a front-of-the-rotation guy.

Among almost a dozen executives from across the baseball spectrum, there is unanimity in this point: The offer that the Twins wound up taking from the Mets is markedly inferior to the deals offered by the Yankees and Red Sox in December. "The difference between Carlos Gomez and Phil Hughes," said one evaluator, "is like night and day."

The Twins tried to re-engage the Yankees Monday night, calling and asking, again, for Hughes to be in a package. The Yankees said no, and the Twins then asked, instead, for Chien-Ming Wang and Ian Kennedy, and the Yankees said no.

The folks who should have felt like idiots in this situation are Theo Epstein and Brian Cashman, writes Patrick Reusse.

Meanwhile, Mets officials went to lunch with Santana's agents.

• Twice Jon Lester has been in the center of the rumor mill, and twice he has wound up sticking with the Red Sox, in the end, as Michael Silverman writes.

• The Mets may be getting Johan Santana, but they are still on probation, writes George Vecsey.

• Santana's rocky finish raises concerns, sort of, as Ben Shpigel writes.

• Phil Hughes will effectively be pitching for Brian Cashman's job, writes Joel Sherman.

• Don't expect a snag in the Santana talks, writes Mark Hale. Reliever Joe Smith and outfielder Moises Alou are pumped up on the deal.

• Carlos Gomez will have huge spikes to fill in center field for the Twins, writes La Velle Neal. None of the four prospects landed by the Twins are superstar prospects, writes Phil Miller.

• The future of the Washington Nationals might be affected by the Johan Santana talks, writes Thom Loverro.

• The Phillies think they can still play with the Mets, writes Todd Zolecki. Experts are picking the Mets now, writes Paul Hagen.

• The Santana deal rocked the Cubs, writes Greg Couch.

There is one very underrated part of this trade: Now that Santana will play in the National League (presumably), we will get to see the full range of his remarkable athleticism -- as he hits, as he makes decisions running the bases, as he fields the many more bunts dropped in the NL, as he holds runners. Teammates say that despite his relatively small frame, his physical strength is extraordinary.

• The Santana talks will have a ripple effect on the Indians' chances of signing C.C. Sabathia; he's as good as gone, writes Paul Hoynes. This deal will put Sabathia right out of the Indians' price range, writes Jim Ingraham.

• Peter Angelos has not been an obstacle in the Erik Bedard talks, says Andy MacPhail. The Bedard talks with the Mariners continue, writes Larry Stone. The O's are hanging on a limb and will go one way or the other, writes Roch Kubatko.

• The prime reliever who would go to the O's in the proposed deal would love to get the chance to be a closer, he tells John Hickey.

• Giants reliever Brian Wilson took his fastball to India this winter, writes Andrew Baggarly.

• The Dodgers sold reliever D.J. Houlton to a team in Japan, writes Tony Jackson.

• The talks with Robinson Cano are over, writes Peter Abraham, who provides the contractual breakdown here.

• The Rangers' search for a president rolls on, writes Anthony Andro.

• The Rockies continue to talk with Brad Hawpe and his agent about a multiyear deal, writes Troy Renck.

• A college coach told a funny 14-year-old story about Todd Helton, on a night when Helton had his baseball number retired by his alma mater, writes Mark Burgess.

• Manny Ramirez is going to the Super Bowl, and he's said to be in great shape, as Gordon Edes writes.

• The Royals agreed to terms with Esteban German.

• The umpires are upset over background checks, writes Ron Blum.

• A former Marlins president interviewed for the Florida State AD job.

• Las Vegas has made the Red Sox the favorites to repeat.

• Roger Clemens made an appearance at the Astros' camp and wouldn't talk about his upcoming Congressional testimony.

• OK, Vanderbilt is now in total freefall.

PED ZONE
• C.C. Sabathia would welcome more stringent testing, writes Murray Evans

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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:21 am

Johan does not replace Glavine (Pedro already was doing that). Johan replaces the previous #5 starter, who gets pushed out. Great article.

http://www.nysun.com/article/70492

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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:23 am

Santana Return Not Enough For Twins



http://www.baseballamerica.com/blog/prospects/?p=707

Posted Jan. 29, 2008 10:32 pm by Jim Callis
Filed under: Transactions

With a full no-trade clause and the right to walk away as a free agent after the 2008 season, Johan Santana was able to exert more control over his destiny than most players ever could dream of. After trade rumors swirled around him throughout the offseason, he wanted his situation resolved this week. The Twins risked getting nothing but two draft picks for the best pitcher of baseball if they stood pat for now and he decided to exercise his no-trade rights in the future.

The Yankees apparently took Phil Hughes off the table in their trade talks with Minnesota, and perhaps the Red Sox were happier to let Santana go to the National League rather than part with a considerable package of young talent to get him. That’s the best explanation as to why the Twins agreed on Tuesday to send Santana to the Mets for four young players: outfielder Carlos Gomez and righthanders Deolis Guerra, Philip Humber and Kevin Mulvey.

That deal hinges on New York’s ability to sign Santana to a long-term contract before a 5 p.m. ET deadline on Friday. Santana’s asking price is reportedly as high as $150 million over six years.

Minnesota might be better off if those talks collapse, giving new Twins GM Bill Smith a chance to find a better return for Santana. While he’s going to command possibly the richest contract ever given to a pitcher, Santana is the best pitcher in the game. And Smith didn’t get enough for him.

Guerra (No. 2), Gomez (No. 3), Mulvey (No. 4) and Humber (No. 7) all ranked prominently on our Mets Top 10 Prospects list. But there’s simply too much risk involved in this deal for Minnesota.

The two best prospects in the trade, Guerra and Gomez, come with high ceilings but also lack a lot of polish and have a long ways to go to reach their potential. The odds that they both will do so are slim.

Guerra has an 89-94 mph fastball and a promising changeup and he’s only 18. But he also has a below-average breaking ball, has yet to pitch more than 90 innings in a season and while he has held his own, he hasn’t dominated. Gomez had the best package of tools in the Mets system, but his bat is still extemely raw as evidenced by his career .273/.331/.384 averages in the minors.

Mulvey has an arsenal of four average pitches and throws strikes. He’s not overpowering and he’s most likely a No. 4 starter. Since having Tommy John surgery in 2005, Humber hasn’t fully regained the stuff that made him the No. 3 overall pick in the 2004 draft. His curveball is his best pitch but his fastball now sits at 87-91 mph. He too projects as a No. 4 starter.

The Twins have traded Santana for two high-reward but also high-risk prospects, and two back-of-the-rotation starters. They didn’t get a prospect whose combination of ceiling and certainty approaches that of Hughes, whom the Yankees were willing to deal for Santana earlier in the winter. They didn’t get a package comparable to the ones the Red Sox reportedly offered earlier, fronted by either Jacoby Ellsbury and Jon Lester and also containing two solid prospects nearly ready for the majors: righty Justin Masterson and shortstop Jed Lowrie.

By this point, however, the Yankees were no longer willing to part with Hughes and the Red Sox may have reduced their offers as well. But even if that left the Mets as the only serious bidders, the Twins should have insisted on New York’s top prospect, outfielder Fernando Martinez.

As it was, Minnesota’s return doesn’t compare favorably to the six-player package the Athletics extracted from the Diamondbacks for Dan Haren. The A’s also got two quality arms from the White Sox for Nick Swisher.

The Twins entered the offseason with three potential frontline starters on their big league roster. They since have traded Santana and Matt Garza, and they’re going to need Francisco Liriano to return to health and their offense to pick up an awful lot of slack.

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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:49 am

Kennedy and Wang?! LOL

Anyway, duno if this was brought up in this 278 page thread, but Torre Hunter's comments reek of a double-standard:

Link

QUOTE
"I hate to hear that," Hunter said, when told of the trade. "I mean, I'm happy for Johan, but he meant so much for that organization. I'm sad for the Twins' organization and all of the fans out there. They loved Johan. This is going to be tough for them to swallow."


Even tho Santana is a much bigger impact player, didn't Hunter himself take the money and run to the Angels?

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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:52 am

Twins Wanted Wang/Kennedy For Santana?




http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2008/01/twins-wanted-wa.html#comments

According to Buster Olney in his blog today:

The Twins tried to re-engage the Yankees Monday night, calling and asking, again, for Hughes to be in a package. The Yankees said no, and the Twins then asked, instead, for Chien-Ming Wang and Ian Kennedy, and the Yankees said no.

This differs from Bob Klapisch's take yesterday. Klapisch said the Twins' last-ditch proposal to the Yankees was for Ian Kennedy, Melky Cabrera, and a top prospect. Regardless, the Yankees preferred to enter the '08 season with Wang, Andy Pettitte, Phil Hughes, and Joba Chamberlain in the rotation. Kennedy and Mike Mussina will compete for the fifth spot.










The Yankees probably hung up the phone laughing when the Twins tried this last ditch effort to get quality in exchange for Santana. They were probably like, "you should have taken the best pitching prospect in baseball and a few other solid prospects THREE MONTHS AGO". That's what you get for jerking people around.

The Mets deserved to get nothing for him for screwing with other teams. The Orioles will get it next if they don't make a decision already. They have had more than enough time.

Posted by: TheGrinch | January 31, 2008 at 10:49 AM

Wow, it must be pretty infuriating for Twins fans to see how they were poised to reap huge packages from teams, that at the time, they considered not good enoungh. Only to wake up and find that all they could get was crap from the Mets, and hear that their organization had to whine and cry to try to get any sort of deal.

It almost would have been more respectable to just keep Johan.

Posted by: BaseBallz | January 31, 2008 at 10:49 AM

*Sorry, I meant to say the Twins deserved to get nothing for him*

Posted by: TheGrinch | January 31, 2008 at 10:49 AM

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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:57 am

Kiper's First-Round Projection
Name Team Player Position
1 Miami Dolphins Glenn Dorsey, DT LSU
2 St. Louis Rams Chris Long, DE Virginia
3 Atlanta Falcons** Matt Ryan, QB Boston College
4 Oakland Raiders** *Darren McFadden, RB Arkansas
5 Kansas City Chiefs** Jake Long, OT Michigan
6 New York Jets *Vernon Gholston, DE Ohio St.
7 New England Patriots (from SF) *Aqib Talib, CB Kansas
8 Baltimore Ravens Sedrick Ellis, DT USC
9 Cincinnati Bengals *Phillip Merling, DE Clemson
10 New Orleans Saints Kentwan Balmer, DT North Carolina
11 Buffalo Bills *Malcolm Kelly, WR Oklahoma
12 Denver Broncos *Ryan Clady, OT Boise St.
13 Carolina Panthers Jeff Otah, OT Pittsburgh
14 Chicago Bears Sam Baker, OT USC
15 Detroit Lions Leodis McKelvin, CB Troy
16 Arizona Cardinals *Jonathan Stewart, RB Oregon
17 Minnesota Vikings *DeSean Jackson, WR California
18 Houston Texans Mike Jenkins, CB South Florida
19 Philadelphia Eagles Chris Williams, OT Vanderbilt
20 Tampa Bay Buccaneers *Felix Jones, RB Arkansas
21 Washington Redskins *Calais Campbell, DE Miami
22 Dallas Cowboys (from CLE) *Mario Manningham, WR Michigan
23 Pittsburgh Steelers *Chilo Rachal, OG USC
24 Tennessee Titans Limas Sweed, WR Texas
25 Seattle Seahawks Fred Davis, TE USC
26 Jacksonville Jaguars *Derrick Harvey, DE Florida
27 San Diego Chargers *Reggie Smith, CB Oklahoma
28 Dallas Cowboys *Rashard Mendenhall, RB Illinois
29 San Francisco 49ers (from IND) *James Hardy, WR Indiana
30 Green Bay Packers Keith Rivers, LB USC
31 New York Giants Dan Connor, LB Penn St.
32 New England Patriots Forfeited pick

Click here to send a question to Mel Kiper for possible use on ESPNEWS.

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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Thu Jan 31, 2008 12:15 pm

Package 1 = Hughes, Melky & Marquez

Package 2 = Wang & Kennedy



What kind of negotiations is that? The second package is worse than the first one!

They wanted 2 major league ready players from the Yankees and took NONE from the Mets.

Once again, It's one price for the Yankees and another price for everyone else.

I knew that bergen record article was bullshit and that clown Smith wouldnt swallow his pride and admit he F'ed up by taking Kennedy & Melky when he could have had Hughes.

SCREW BILL SMITH!

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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Thu Jan 31, 2008 12:16 pm

I can't really blame teams for that. We're just so damn nice. I wouldn't want to help the Yanks at all if I were another team (especially one in the AL).

As for the Mutts, I'll believe a WS when I see it. They're in for a long ride with the older players they have. THey better pray that the real Jose Reyes shows up this year too.

Bill Smith is a fool! And how dare they ask for Wang, when they are getting just prospects back from the Mets. Not even Jose Reyes, John Maine, or Fernando Martinez? I'm glad Cash told them to get lost.




Jan 31, 2008 12:19 pm - Buzz: Mets and Santana are Far Apart


http://www.metsblog.com/


...posted by Matthew Cerrone...

In a report for ESPN.com, citing ‘sources familiar with the discussions,’ Jayson Stark explains that the Mets and Johan Santana remain far enough apart that a deal is unlikely to be reached until at least Friday.

Stark adds, “The sources also left open the possibility that the talks could collapse without an agreement, though the odds of that appear remote.”

…do you have to use that word, jayson…come on now…

According to Stark’s sources, Santana and his agents are still pushing for a six-year extension in the range of $150 million, while the Mets want to limit the guaranteed portion of the extension to five years.

This morning, the Pioneer Press reported the same information, noting that the Mets and Santana’s agent discussed a six-year deal worth more than $150 million, including a $7 million signing bonus and performance incentives.

…i’ll tell ya, nothing is ever easy in the world of blue and orange…

…by the way, even if the the Mets and santana reach an agreement this second, the team will likely hold off on having a press conference to celebrate the signing until next week, a) because he’ll still need to take a physical, and b) half of the city’s sports reporters are out in Phoenix covering the Super Bowl…

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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Thu Jan 31, 2008 12:22 pm

Mike and the Mad Dog just can’t get this thing right! These clowns are still talking about how Santana didn’t want to go to the Mets because the Yankees and Red Sox were his first choices! Do some research fellas.
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Funny you say that.

From Espn:

In the meantime, there are signs that the Mets continue to express interest in free-agent pitcher Kyle Lohse. Lohse was viewed, essentially, as the Mets’ backup plan in case they weren’t able to trade for Santana. But when one baseball man who had spoken with Mets GM Omar Minaya was asked if the club could end up with both Santana and Lohse, the reply was: “Absolutely.”

I still say they should go for Freddy Garcia. Should be easier for him to take less guarnteed years, and he has more upside.
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I guess the Mets are concerned about that 6th year. In the 5th and 6th years of this contract Johan will be pitching at the same age that Pedro has pitched in each of his last two season. I love Pedro and think the Mets got him at a great time and even though his #’s were decent when he pitched last year there has been a noticeable decline in his ’stuff’ over the past two seasons. Do the Mets want to be paying 25 million when Johan is on the DL or throwing 88? That’s more a Yankees move than anything. That being said, at this point you give him whatever he wants, money, perks, a date with your daughter….it doesn’t matter. Like Buster Olney wrote in his blog “Santana in commanding position” when this deal happened, it’s gotta be nice to be Johan’s agent right about now! To summarize what he said, the Mets will say no up until the point they can’t say no anymore and then they will say yes……..because they just have to……and Peter Greenberg knows that.





Yes santana has leverage but it is also in his best interest to work this out. Neither side wants to see this thing fall apart. If the Twins had to start this process all over again then they would get even less and more then likely Santana would be pitching in Minny next year.

So yes the Mets have to give in but Santana also needs to play ball and be somewhat reasonable.




You can’t compare Johan to Pedro. Mets knew going in that Pedro had a partially torn cuff and would eventually need surgery. That’s why the Sox didn’t want to sign him to a long term contract. Johan has no real medical issues so it’s possible he’ll be able to get through the contract without any major surgery.
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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Thu Jan 31, 2008 12:24 pm

Buzz: Mets and Santana are Far Apart



http://www.metsblog.com/2008/01/31/buzz-mets-and-santana-are-far-apart/#comments

In a report for ESPN.com, citing ‘sources familiar with the discussions,’ Jayson Stark explains that the Mets and Johan Santana remain far enough apart that a deal is unlikely to be reached until at least Friday.

Stark adds, “The sources also left open the possibility that the talks could collapse without an agreement, though the odds of that appear remote.”

…do you have to use that word, jayson…come on now…

According to Stark’s sources, Santana and his agents are still pushing for a six-year extension in the range of $150 million, while the Mets want to limit the guaranteed portion of the extension to five years.

This morning, the Pioneer Press reported the same information, noting that the Mets and Santana’s agent discussed a six-year deal worth more than $150 million, including a $7 million signing bonus and performance incentives.

…i’ll tell ya, nothing is ever easy in the world of blue and orange…

…by the way, even if the the Mets and santana reach an agreement this second, the team will likely hold off on having a press conference to celebrate the signing until next week, a) because he’ll still need to take a physical, and b) half of the city’s sports reporters are out in Phoenix covering the Super Bowl…





I heard Santana and his agent wants 6 years $155 million dollars. I hope Mets sign and give Johan want He wants.


I heard Santana wants 6 years $155 million dollars. I hope Mets sign and give Johan wants He wants

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Re: Hank On Santana To Mets

Post  RedMagma on Thu Jan 31, 2008 12:31 pm

Pressure’s gonna drop on you

http://www.nypost.com/seven/01312008/sports/yankees/phils_pitching_for_a_job___cashmans_676247.htm

Joel Sherman of the Post goes deeper with a point I made the other day: The non-trade for Johan Santana could determine Brian Cashman’s future.

Ian Kennedy and three guys off the street were a better package than what the Mets gave up. The Yankees could have had Santana. But Cashman stood his ground.

It’s a commendable stance and the message is clear: The Yankees aren’t developing these pitchers to trade them. But if Santana is the new Tom Seaver and the Yankees finish a game out of the wild card, Hammerin’ Hank might want a new GM.

There’s always pressure when you’re the GM of the Yankees. Cashman is coming up on 10 years on the job. He didn’t get this far without ducking a few punches.

Joel also writes that the pressure’s on Phil Hughes. That’s true. But Hughes knew what he was doing when he took $1.4 million to sign with the Yankees in 2004. If he didn’t want pressure, he would have gone to college.









# Blargh January 31st, 2008 at 11:53 am

But seriously Pete, is it more pressure than normal?… xP
# Who Needs Johan January 31st, 2008 at 11:55 am

The Santana deal looked worse the later it became. Lets say he did it this week, who’s in CF this season? Cameron was off the market so there were holes now that really can’t be sufficiently filled now.

Cash did the right thing, stay the course and let the boys mature. Besides $140 million?
# Clay Bellinger January 31st, 2008 at 11:56 am

Pete updated his picture, Haha.
# Old Goat January 31st, 2008 at 11:57 am

Is there any word coming from a real source as to what the Twins were looking for from the Yankees to make the trade? From some places it was Kennedy, Melky and prospect. From Olney and a few others it was a change from Hughes and Kennedy to Kennedy and Wang plus others.

If that later is true, then Cashman would have been crazy to take the deal, which he didn’t. If it was the former, the truly lesser package, then it doesn’t make as much sense.

It seems as though Cashman AND Hal were against the trade and signing costs, more than Hank was.

If that is the case, then I don’t think it puts Cashman into such a bad position. If the Twins were still asking for two- three MLB players from the Yankees, and then took the Mets deal, then the Twins GM Smith was just looking to pressure the Mets for more.
# Bronxbyte January 31st, 2008 at 11:59 am

There’s pressure on Santana also. He has to make a big splash in Queens and help Mets fans and players to forget The Great Meltdown of September, 2007.
Any GM of the Yankees has pressure. It comes with the job and Brian Cashman will be the first of many to say so.
# Manton January 31st, 2008 at 12:02 pm

First, loved the Pressure Drop title.

Second, aren’t Johan’s numbers going to be inflated because he’s moving from the AL to the NL, so the odds are that the perception will be skewed regardless of how well he actually does? Even if his pitching quality continues to drop a bit like it has been, won’t the numbers be masked since he’s pitching to hitters that are of a sub-AL talent level?

Come on Phil, you gotta win the Cy Young for Cash!
# Whatevered January 31st, 2008 at 12:04 pm

At the end of the day the Twins wanted Santana out of the AL and the Mets were the only offer. The pressure on Phil will probably be the same as last year when fans believed he’ll be the next ace, now he has to try to reach what the fans believe Joba will be. IPK has less pressure and a bigger chance than most see. You might be thanking Cashman for not trading him and Melky.
# SJ44 January 31st, 2008 at 12:05 pm

There is always pressure on Cashman. This year? Sure, maybe a little more because he’s in the final year of his contract.

It was no different the last time his contract came around with the 2004 choke still fresh in George’s mind. The job comes with pressure. Just the way it is.

Several credible sources have the Twins asking for Wang, Kennedy and Cabrera in their last ditch effort to make a deal the other day.

If that’s true, its pretty clear why Cashman turned that deal down.

Also, what’s not mentioned, and what we don’t know is, if Cashman said “yes” to that offer, does Smith say, “deal” or does he go back to the Red Sox and shop the offer? History says it would have been the latter. You just end up being a hamster on a wheel going in circles with a GM (Smith) clearly out of his element.

Bottom line is, Santana isn’t with the Yankees and the Yankees have a very good team heading to Tampa.

Now, we get to see how good.
# Kevin P January 31st, 2008 at 12:05 pm

I think once again the media goes waaaaaay overboard with this. No matter if Santana has a great year and if the Mets win alot, this is a trade that will take years to decide who was right/wrong. Heck, Santana in the NL should be a huge shot in his arm IF he was on somewhat of a decline. I could win 10 games in the NL.

Twins have no concrete proof on how these young players will turn out and no one is expecting Hughes to win the Cy Young this year.

There is almost always some type of growing pains associated with young players.

For anyone to think this short sighted and think Hal/Hank are gonna go ape$%it is Santana does good for the Mets and the Yankee prospects struggle is a little overboard.

Granted no discussion about the Yankees is every in the realm of sanity to begin with.

RedMagma

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